Balance discussion meeting


#1

Remember my balancing council idea? Let’s just do that right now. Why not? We’re a tight knit community here, and most of us know a lot more about the weaponry and meta than most PF players. So let’s sit down and have a discussion about it. Let’s come together as a community and have an actual discussion on what weapons need to be changed or nerfed or buffed or whatever. I’ll just lead in the conversation myself.

@Darkman_Bree @SVGSig @Skillzz @Mage9715 @heckgod @Guy_with_no_name obligatory ping for everyone who might be remotely interested in discussing balancing. Also no flame wars please. It’s ironic coming from me, but whatever, this is the last place we need it. And Darkman no memeing about the FAL.

Anyways let’s get this out of the way with me starting the conversation. Let’s talk about the really overpowered aspects of the game. There’s a few to list off and I’ll do so briefly.

FAL 50.00: It’s the best primary in the game right now, hands down. I think the thing keeping it this busted is its 3sk to the torso at longer ranges. My personal belief is that we should trade that out for another advantage.

M1911: I think we all know exactly why this needs a nerf. It has vastly overcentralized the pistol meta, and is one of the best guns in the entire game. Not sure how to go about nerfing it though.

Armor Piercing: We have an entire thread dedicated to this, so we shouldn’t get too in depth about the discussion. But you all know why it’s broken. Overcentralizes the meta and breaks guns, you know how it is. A lot of super broken guns are made super broken by AP. We fix AP, we fix them.

BFG .50: Still just the worst, even after the buffs. It still needs buffs.

Yeah those are just the big ones. So let’s get talking. Anyone have any proposals on balancing, put em in the comments.


#2

The FAL could be nerfed by dropping the min damage to 24, but it still has the multi, making it a 4sk ,

BFG just needs a reload speed buff walk speed buff, it’s supposed to be the lightest 50 bmg rifle right ?so it should have the fastest handling traits to make up for having one shot


#3

Ill let you nerds do this shit. Damn crackers are even more nerdy than this chink


#4

BFG I agree with. For the FAL though we would have to give it something in return because the way you make it out, it’d be super weak.


#5

Mmm… your right 30 damage would be more preferable ,so it’s still a 3sk to the head my n


#6

If we do end up nerfing AP so that it no longer increases damage at range, then that could justify making most battle rifles a 4shot torso at all ranges (the exception would be the AG-3 and the Henry).


#7

Why don’t we make the FAL have uncontrollable recoil that is only effective at close range (shades of M231 recoil) and in return make its tap fire excellent at spamming single shots?


#8

Okay, you said no mememing, fine.
Here comes serious Darkman.

FAL 50.00 is a very strong battle rifle indeed, and MAYBE, just maybe, it does need a minor nerf, And yes, I hurt myself for typing that.
I think the FAL 50.00 can be fine without that torso multiplier.

It’s very strong, but I still think the M45A1 is better, and the Five-seveN even better, I don’t think it needs a nerf.

NERF. IT. NOW!!!

Why not return the 1-hit kill anywhere if it’s still the worst gun in the game?
I don’t see anyway else to buff it except reload speed.


#9

I think simply lowering the fire rate to 600 is a good place to start,then we re-evaluate to see if it’s too severe or if it’s still too strong


#10

I think I have an idea. A fusion of your and Guy’s ideas.

We change the FAL 50.00’s damage to 48-20, set its range to 30-120 studs, and increase its recoil a bit, while keeping a 1.2x torso multiplier.

With this change the FAL becomes an absolute god in CQC, being able to two shot to the torso. It would remain a big threat at medium range if you can hit torso shots (made harder by y recoil), but its dominance at long range is hampered since it can’t 4 shot outside of around 120 studs.

This makes the FAL a bit janky but it’s a good kind of janky I feel.

@Darkman_Bree @Guy_with_no_name what do you think of this


#11

It’s like a mixed bag for me, it’s basically a FAL para shorty with some range to it


#12

Except if the FAL PARA Shorty was even better in CQC, but with speed downsides .


#13

so what do we do about the scar-H now? that thing is still nerfed been nerfed to hell


#14

I have a slightly different idea.
The FAL damage is changed to 41-28 (48-20 damage is nice to make it unique, but I’m afraid this will outperform the FAL 50.63, assuming that no other FAL variants gets changed for balancing reasons), torso multiplier is the same at 1.1x, range remains unchanged, and increase its recoil significantly (but not exactly like M231 level). However, the 1st shot recoil is fairly high but controllable vertical but can be spammed efficently like a DMR (but not as effective proper DMR). Basically, it’s still powerful in CQC, but the FAL can’t be used to spray effectively at medium and long-range. At medium range, the recoil is harsh enough to incentivize players to burst fire. At long range, even burst firing it is not that efficient, so players have the incentive to use semi-auto or tap fire.
What do you think?


#15

Alright, lets get my biggest complaint outta the way.

The BFG, this should be addressed soon. Lets discuss how to fix it:

Firstly, improve the overall speed of the weapon, not necessarily the reload, but things like ADS time and overall walkspeed. It’s like slower than the Intervention, that doesn’t make sense.
Next, I’d say increase the velocity slightly regardless of realism or whatever, just give the players a reason to potentially consider it over the other rifles, less travel time would certainly assist. I don’t want an inferior Hecate cluttering the Recon class. Not saying the Hecate is good or anything, but I think it’s balanced rn. Oh yeah, also add back the potential for the gun to 1-shot anywhere, that’d be unique.

This last one is a note to the Devs/@litozinnamon , ignore the complaints from degenerates about how the gun is OP or whatever, those should be disregarded completely, they’ve already demonstrated how they completely lack knowledge of good game design and balance. The BFG as it stands is the worse gun in the game and the other .50 BMG snipers are objectively better in literally every way. A higher rank weapon shouldn’t be a literal upgrade to the older ones, the BFG is already at a huge disadvantage due to the 1 boolet capacity. This isn’t exactly something that can be changed without an entire weapon overhaul, so expand upon the BFG in order to make it somewhat viable.

TL;DR Give the players a reason to pick the BFG over the other Snipers. Give it some sort of aura that no other weapon possess. And no, the 1 bullet capacity doesn’t count.

P.S Jesus christ, we’ve got a lot of fixing to do.


#16

why not bring back the pre-nerf beta BFG? but nerf the reserves more


#17

I’d say do that, increase movement speed, and lastly increase the muzzle velocity to like 3300 studs/s even though that isn’t realistic or whatever. (Technically the more accurate muzzle velocity for the BFG is 2930ish studs/s anyways when feet per second is converted to studs.) Do this and you’ve finally got yourself a sniper that’s worth using. Basically, make it the fastest mobility .50 BMG rifle with the best velocity to compensate for the 1 bullet cap. And yeah, 1shot anywhere is reasonable too.

Also making the reserves 35 might be a good idea.


#18

That’s fair I’d say.

But then you’re at the risk of further invalidating the Beowulf ECR, as it can also 2sk up close but it only has a 10 round mag.
What I’m suggesting is, we give the ECR some sort of variant of the FAL’s current stats (while keeping the 2sk up close), and then change the FAL to what you suggested. That way the FAL remains competitive up close, and the ECR would also be able to compete if the user was skilled enough.

Let’s be honest, the ECR could use a buff.


#19

the ECR does 33 damage min with the multi iirc

4sk on a 50.Beowulf Battle rifle lol


#20

Yep, and that’s a 4sk at its minimum range. And the dropoff on the ECR is pretty terrible With a 10rnd mag, I think it should 3sk with the torso multi. As in, it would do 33 to the limbs, and 35 to the torso, a 4sk is pretty pathetic for a 10rnd mag tbh.